Funny | Satire | Thoughts

Who called Dibs?

December 28, 2008

Hi PD… Um, ok. I’ll play along.

You said this:

Atheists keep Christmas as a special day – it was theirs before Christians. It’s special to us too – just not the same as to Christians. Atheists and Deists keep it for the celebration of family, love and friends.

Merry Christmas to you!

Comment by PD December 27, 2008 @ 10:51 am

Christ Mass, as the birth of the Christ Child was set in A.D.354.

Christianity as a recognizable belief system only pre-dates that by approximately 300 +/- years while the earliest dates for atheism, the belief system which denies the existence of or need for a God or Super Intelligence are from ancient China, approx 2500 years ago.   Theism, the belief that God created the universe and then abandoned it, which, if you’ll pardon me sounds like an adult tantrum at the great cosmic Deity in the sky, I think may have originated with Cain right after he killed his brother and ran off to wander about with a mark on his forehead.

But since we aren’t discussing the validity of belief systems but rather who gets dibs on Christmas?

Well, the Mid Winter celebration such as what came to be known as the Christ Mass, specifically 12/25, was originally known as the Dies Natalis Solis Invicti, festival of Sol, the invincible sun god.  A “religious” if decidedly <i>not</i> Christian observance.   It is not the Winter Solstice which doesn’t fall on the 25th with any regularity, if ever.  And, with fear and trembling, I just disagreed with Sir Isaac Newton.  Very arrogant of me.  I did, though agree with Paul Ernst Jablonski, a German protestant from 1750(and change).

The solstice, at least in the Northern Hemisphere, is 12/20-12/23, ish.  And it’s history is from Celtic legend and story/myth.  The religious significance of the re-birth of their sun-god on the longest night of the year can’t be separated from the observance of this ritual/event.   Additional odd knowledge to bring more confusion to the subject at hand says:

Since 45 BCE, when the 25th was established in the  Julian calendar as the winter solstice of Europe, the difference between the calendar year (365.2500 days) and the tropical year(365.2422 days) moved the day associated with the actual astronomical solstice forward approximately three days every four centuries until 1582 when  Pope Gregory XIII changed the calendar bringing the northern winter solstice to around December 21.

So…. If we are going to be fair, then 12/25 belongs to the Celts or the Romans as they paid homage to their sun deity and secondarily to the Christians when they laid claim to the day for specific significant observances millenia ago.  All of these religious belief systems are acknowledging a divine existence and don’t purpot that that divinity has abandoned his creation.   A system of celebration which stands in stark contrast to the belief systems of both atheists or theists.

You claim that 12/25 belonged to atheists long before it belonged to whom?  Christians?   Well, when, exactly did athiests/theists decide to observe an historically religious day as specific for themselves?  And I mean religious in regards to any sense of spirituality.  You cannot have a religious/spiritual observance without the recognition or acknowledgment of some sort of deity.

Since there are 364 other days which would work just as well?   Would it be all that hard to make one up?   I mean, enough people believed and Kwanzaa happened.   You could have a “believe nothing but what is tangible” day on July 25th instead?  You could call it We See It, It’s Real Day or Happy Tangibles, or No Need for Faith Day.  I don’t know.  Calling it Christ Mass seems a bit disingenuous, even for me.  Besides, in July the weather is better and the parties could be without the stigma of glorifying or acknowledging the spirituality of anything!

But I digress.

If Christ  Mass is a day where you celebrate family, love and friends….  By all means! Do it!    Just make sure it’s not the only day you do.

  • Applauding

  • Not a comment aboutibbs but about the little snow flakes or stars or what ever they are that fall along the grey side bars. They make my browser scroll even slower than they move and I have to wait to see what I have written in this comment. It looks nice but older computers can’t handle the strain. Just thought you’d like to know. Thanks for letting me get that off my CPU.

  • Even though your son is extremely disappointed because apparently, although he rarely even looks at my blog he *hearts* the snowflakes, I have disabled them for you. From my CPU to yours! 😀

  • I dare say that PD is probably not much welcome in atheist circles, either. (Perhaps that is why PD specifically mentioned Deism?)

    The major problem that people who are angry at The One God have is that there is so much confusion and disagreement among their ranks. I wonder why that is.

    Further discussion on this topic will be pursued at the next meeting of the Anarchist’s Association.

  • aw

    believe nothing but what is tangible day – Snort. I spit my coffee. Dang but you crack me up.

  • Holiday season or not, wouldn’t it be a great idea if we all stopped disecting each other’s motives and accepted one another 🙂

    That really wasn’t a question 😉

    PEACE out!

  • As I read what you write, I keep thinking that you would enjoy being a part of a message board my friend made. It is mortalclay.aimoo.com =) Check it out!!

  • Holiday season or not, wouldn’t it be a great idea if we all stopped disecting each other’s motives and accepted one another

    Yeah. Wouldn’t it be cool if I could flap my arms and fly? It’s a great idea and nothing more. Can’t happen. Won’t happen.

    Are you interested in make-believe and wish-lists or reality?

    There are people dying in Israel as I type this… from Hamas rockets. I get a text message on my phone every time a rocket hits in the Gaza strip as a reminder to pray for those people.

    I volunteered for that yesterday and I got little sleep last night.

    Reality is that there is really, for real, some good and some evil. As pretty as it seems, there is no “gray area.” It’s black and white.

    Stop vacillating and decide which side you’re on. We’re at war. “The fighting’s commenced! Get to fighting or get away!”

    Or would you rather hug your cat and go back to bed to watch another episode of “Home Improvement” from your collection of DVDs? Picking a side can be difficult. You didn’t even identify the problem correctly; it’s not really about “dissecting motives.” Those are published and clear.

    (This isn’t personal. I don’t even know you Wonder Woman. But, damn! Have you looked around you or read some news lately?)

    Fuck the atheists. They’re stupid, disorganized and weak. They’re loud but no threat to anyone. Powerless crybabies.

    God’s people are DYING in Israel. Today. Because there are real enemies in this world, they have explosives and they are determined.